sugar dosing...

[wolmutt]

I'm thinking about dosing sugar and was wondering what amount to use, how much, how often, etc. I looked on RC but couldn't find any information that gave any useable directions for dosing sugar. Thanks.

[tjp]

http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=898931

this the one?

[wolmutt]

yeah, I read that. Problem is he is the only guy stating that, and he doesn't know the difference between anaerobic and aerobic bacteria. Thank you. Anyone else out there want to pipe up?

[mattb]

Don't use sugar... use vodka. Ethanol is a better source of carbon than table sugar.

[wolmutt]

mattb, can I borrow a tiny bit of vodka. I don't drink and don't really feel comfortable with having a bottle sitting around. That would give you a good reason to come over and test my T5 HO system :biggthumpup:

[wolmutt]

Also, did you ever figure out what species that frag I gave you was? I'm interested because it might not be the same colony as another frag I have.

[hypertech]

mattb, can I borrow a tiny bit of vodka. I don't drink and don't really feel comfortable with having a bottle sitting around. That would give you a good reason to come over and test my T5 HO system :biggthumpup:

Found a container. I've got some to bring you though I don't really know how much you need.

[wolmutt]

80 to 120ml is my best guess.

[spsick]

what, are you going for a one time dosage?

[mattb]

mattb, can I borrow a tiny bit of vodka. I don't drink and don't really feel comfortable with having a bottle sitting around. That would give you a good reason to come over and test my T5 HO system :biggthumpup:

My bad.... Yes, that would be a good excuse :) I'll pm you to see when you have time...

The only reason I said vodka is that there is some (anecdotal, very much) info from sugar users about sugar causing what is being called cyano outbreaks, and there are more reported 'brown outs'.... Try sugar and see, I don't know what the exact dosing recommendations are though.

[mattb]

Also, from a conversation with Fritz and Li at SWE today... if you are running GFO and plan on dosing organic carbon STOP with the GFO, it's counterproductive....

Also, I'd suggest having good NO3 and PO4 test kits when dosing carbon...

[hamdogg08]

Regarding sugar:
The reason that it's not as good as the vodka is that it's not as pure of a source of carbon. I'm guessing that there's other stuff in there that'll be extra rubbish for your tank

Vodka:
Dose 1ml/100L

[Goldpony75]

This is just a baseline of where to start with Vodka dosing. Every system is different and before anyone does vadka dosing you need to read up on it. RC has a great and really long thread on it. I have also noticed that for some reason when I use different quality of vodka my dosing needs to be adjusted a little. and yes it is the same proof vodka I used just a different brand and quality. I am at 30ml a day on a 120 display 180gallon system. Vodka:
Dose 1ml/100L

[mattb]

Regarding sugar:
The reason that it's not as good as the vodka is that it's not as pure of a source of carbon. I'm guessing that there's other stuff in there that'll be extra rubbish for your tank

Vodka:
Dose 1ml/100L

Vodka isn't pure either... Regular vodka is 80 proof or 40% ethanol... the other stuff is impurities.

Ethanol
C2H5OH

Sugar/sucrose
C12H22O11

So we're not even comparing apples to apples, they are different sources of organic C, and different organisms may utilize them better than other organisms...

My thread on Rc
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1225324&perpage=25&pagenumber=1

The original RC vodka thread with dosing instructions....
http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=288714&perpage=25&highlight=vodka&pagenumber=21

[coralreefer]

Why don't you try and get regular ethanol? We use it in my lab regularly.

[mattb]

Why don't you try and get regular ethanol? We use it in my lab regularly.

You mean like 100% ethanol? Most people don't have access to that... have to imagine that's super flamable too.

[coralreefer]

You mean like 100% ethanol? Most people don't have access to that... have to imagine that's super flamable too.
Yeah, I wasn't really sure how easy that would be to acquire. You would definitely want to use caution with it. It would reduce the impurity with other EtOH sources.

[hypertech]

Could always get E85 in a pinch :biggrin:

[wes]

man, too bad my work ended at the lab--I could've brought home plenty of methanol for people to play around with. Matt, your tank looks great and you're getting good growth, what're you hoping to change?

[wolmutt]

The tank is doing good, but I get some patches of diatoms, or whatever they are, more than I would like. Also, I'm hoping to curve the plans of any aggressive algaes such as byropsis. The mag trick is good, but I am not getting the results from it that I was expecting. Plus, a guy has to tinker with s&*t it's part of the hobby :biggthumpup:

[wolmutt]

I had no idea a 120 would need 30ml a day. I've got a lot to learn about vodka dosing. Anyone please feel free to regurgitate your knowledge. I'm a :lots:

[mattb]

Each system is different... on my 120 I maxed out at 12ml/day of vodka... Also, low nutrients aren't enough to curb many nuisance algaes, only predation is, unfortunately bryopsis is one of those that can grow in a nutrient poor environment....

[cwk132]

Well I have been reading up on carbon dosing and I was wondering if anyone could tell me if my basic understanding is correct.

The purpose is to supply the bacteria colonies existing in our tank with 'food" so that these bacterias can also uptake N and P (in the forms of NO4 and PO4) to basically outcompete the algaes in our tanks and also in our corals. The increased bacteria colonies are then skimmed out (also read that they could be used by corals?) effectively removing N and P with it. Problems can be run into if too much is being dosed with bacteria blooms as well as bacteria growth "mats" on pumps and on places of lower flow. Also, since corals do need at least some N and P in the water, if too much is removed, corals can become "pastel colored", meaning that there is not enough N and P in your tank. Which means you can either feed more, or reduce your dosing some. With carbon dosing you eventually want to find an equilibrium where you are able to keep corals happy, feed your fish enough, have crystal clear water, and have very little algae.

Sorry for the long "summary" but does that sound about right? I have more questions for you guys who have tried this or read up about it a lot, but I figured I would at least make sure I was more familiar with carbon dosing. Thanks a ton guys, Charlie.