Death rate for corals.

Discussion in 'General Reef Discussion' started by Reefking, Apr 15, 2018 at 6:39 PM.

  1. Reefking

    Reefking Senior Member
    TCMAS Member

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2015
    Messages:
    462
    Likes Received:
    63
    Location:
    Plymouth
    Fishies collected:
    19,617
    8D425857-7D0E-43C0-A969-D5A1014AE2ED.jpeg i just read an article that 98 percent of wild caught marine fish are dead within one year from the Philippines. I wonder what the survival rate is for wild caught sps corals? I am becoming less and less of a fan buying wild caught sps corals for a variety of reasons. First, I believe the survival rate of wild caught sps corals is horrible. For the most part, I have had much better success with aquacultured corals. I think I have 5 wild caught colonies in my tank. No more...

    Regards
    Reefking
     
    #1 Reefking, Apr 15, 2018 at 6:39 PM
    Last edited: Apr 15, 2018 at 6:46 PM
    • Like Like x 1
  2. DarkSky

    DarkSky I contributed!
    Lifetime Member Event Committee

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2016
    Messages:
    409
    Likes Received:
    75
    Location:
    Eden Prairie
    Fishies collected:
    9,334
    I have a piece of ocean harvested SPS in my tank. I bought it when it was colony sized and most RTNed in a few days. I cut a few 1" pieces that still had tissue and stuck them on a frag plug. I kept moving them around my tank trying to find a good place it liked and it finally settled under the most intense lighting and flow in my tank. It's now turning green from the light brown it was, so it's on the path towards recovery. Will be excited to see what it colors up to be.

    I have limited experience with harvested coral but the one experience I do have makes me agree that I'll probably not get any ocean harvested pieces in the future.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  3. jlanger

    jlanger "The North Remembers"
    Lifetime Member Event Committee

    Joined:
    May 8, 2010
    Messages:
    3,448
    Likes Received:
    483
    Location:
    New Richmond, WI
    Fishies collected:
    40,809
    The death rate for everything on this planet is 100%. Everything dies.

    I also believe that wild caught corals have a tougher time acclimating to aquarium conditions; especially if they're going through the collection>wholesaler>retailer>buyer in a very short period of time. It seems that the amount of stress that the corals are subjected to are more detrimental to their survival rate than that of fish. Corals depend on a lot more conditions to remain stable to survive than sturdier fish. If a coral colony can spend a longer period of time recovering from collection before moving onto the next and the next stop, I believe they fare better. So maybe that's why the maricultured and aquacultured coral colonies have a better survival rate when they reach our aquariums.

    BTW... That's a great looking Miyagi Tort you have there. I really miss having mine.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  4. Discus fever

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2011
    Messages:
    97
    Likes Received:
    9
    Location:
    Rochester
    Fishies collected:
    1,363
    Im going to take the skeptical side on this one. I do believe the death rate is high but 98%? I didnt read the article but I have several problems with it. Let me throw out some questions.
    Who is tracking this and how? Once those fish hit the wholesalers they blowing in the wind everywhere.
    Why were they even pretending to track it in the first place? A negative wild caught fish campaign? Who funded the article?
    Why only the Philippines?
    What wholesaler is repeatedly buying fish with such a low success? If a year is the time frame, you know that most aren't making it even close to that. There isnt enough profit in fish to cover those kinds of losses. If there was then lfs wouldnt be going out of business constantly.

    As for the coral, I have/have had wild and maricultured pieces and the death rates seems similar. You might even say mostly my fault.
    I am going to make the arguement that maricultured corals make the exact same trip to my tank as a wild specimen. Maybe a little less time in the collection boat but they came from the same ocean, go to(probably the same) the collection facility, then the wholesaler, then the retailer, and finally to me.
    To possibly coincide with previous comments, I tried to set up a large tranship order last year and the importer informed me that Aussie coral tend to look the best they ever will right when you recieve them. It's downhill from there. He claimed bali and other coral tend to improve coloration after 3-6 months. My order was hurricaned so I may never know. :(
    Not trying to discredit anyone here but momma always said " dont believe everything you read"
    OK. let me have it;)
     
    • Like Like x 1
  5. RSnodgrass

    RSnodgrass TCMAS President
    Staff Member BOD Lifetime Member Event Committee

    Joined:
    Apr 7, 2007
    Messages:
    3,072
    Likes Received:
    297
    Location:
    Lynd, MN, United States
    Fishies collected:
    43,865
    I can't speak to coral completely... I don't generally buy wild colonies, just don't like it. I'd only hypothesize three things:
    A) A handful of those grow-out facilities are in the US so they wouldn't have the same shipping experience in those cases.
    B) Not all suppliers do mariculture so if you break down suppliers who offer mariculture from not there may be a big difference in their handling process in general. Those offering mariculture or farm raised have a much higher steak in it cost wise so I'd expect a higher degree of care (maybe not).
    C) A colony by definition is much larger than a frag which equals more surface area which equals more opportunities for one little part to get infected killing the whole colony in minutes or days. If the shipping of a colony was not ideal and it wasn't stress free prior to shipping it's a roll of the dice.

    As for fish... three things:
    A) I tend to agree with your skepticism but once you include the hobbyist into that equation I wouldn't be shocked to see it really high, at least 75%. The profit has already been made before most of the losses occur. Their sample size was probably 100 fish for all we know. Most of my orders have been through Blue Zoo over the years... seeing my order history isn't pretty.
    B) New hobbyist kill alot of fish because their adding them more frequently then a seasoned hobbyist I'd bet. Oh, and that part about being new.
    C) I don't really care how many die in a year if the collection numbers are sustainable. Just like deer, their going to die anyway and the ecosystem can only support so many. The difference is a single fish (say a lion) produce over 2 million eggs a year and mortality of baby fish on the reef is in the 90 percentile (forget exactly).
     

Share This Page