How many heaters

Discussion in 'General Reef Discussion' started by H2OHOH, Jul 13, 2019.

  1. H2OHOH

    H2OHOH Senior Member
    TCMAS Member

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2015
    Messages:
    1,070
    Likes Received:
    306
    Location:
    Minneapolis
    how many heaters do you use
     
  2. jlanger

    jlanger "The North Remembers"
    Lifetime Member Event Committee

    Joined:
    May 8, 2010
    Messages:
    4,548
    Likes Received:
    1,150
    Location:
    New Richmond, WI
    Two.

    Both heaters are controlled via my Apex with each heater on a separate EB832 energy bars.
    In addition, each outlet is programmed to be “on” for only twelve hours each day; creating opposite shifts. If a heater or energy bar fails and the temperature drops below my set threshold, I will get a text alarm. I am then able to determine which heater or energy bar has failed. After 30 minutes???, the other heater will be turned on and return my water temp to its targeted temperature.

    Redundancy is key when dealing with heaters.
     
  3. OP
    H2OHOH

    H2OHOH Senior Member
    TCMAS Member

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2015
    Messages:
    1,070
    Likes Received:
    306
    Location:
    Minneapolis
    What brand and watt are you using
     
  4. jlanger

    jlanger "The North Remembers"
    Lifetime Member Event Committee

    Joined:
    May 8, 2010
    Messages:
    4,548
    Likes Received:
    1,150
    Location:
    New Richmond, WI
    Finnex 500watt Deluxe Titanium Heating Element
     
  5. Mordim

    Mordim Just keep reefing
    BOD Lifetime Member Event Committee TCMAS Member Meeting Host 2019

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2018
    Messages:
    252
    Likes Received:
    74
    Location:
    Zimmerman, MN, USA
    I use two heaters controlled by my Apex . It turns both on and off at the same time. They are slightly under powered such that one cannot heat the tank completely by itself. This is a safety measure in case the Apex and the heater controller fail and also it fails on, it won't cook everything. I use the same heater in my mixing station as a back up.

    I do like jlanger's idea of alternating to determine if one fails. Although it requires that each heater is strong enough to heat the tank by itself and has the risk of frying the tank of it fails on.
     
  6. OP
    H2OHOH

    H2OHOH Senior Member
    TCMAS Member

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2015
    Messages:
    1,070
    Likes Received:
    306
    Location:
    Minneapolis
    Do you separate on plug in blocks because of amps, or redundancy?

    Am I ok to put two 300w on one block. I have 80 gallon display
     
  7. jlanger

    jlanger "The North Remembers"
    Lifetime Member Event Committee

    Joined:
    May 8, 2010
    Messages:
    4,548
    Likes Received:
    1,150
    Location:
    New Richmond, WI
    Redundancy; if one energy bar fails, the other may be unaffected.

    You should be fine.
     
  8. Fross

    Fross Senior Member
    TCMAS Member TCMAS Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2013
    Messages:
    303
    Likes Received:
    126
    Location:
    Loretto
    My tank will be using two. One on apex, one on an ink bird. Not sure why or how yet. A third will be in the ATO/AWC tank.
     
  9. Reefking

    Reefking Senior Member
    TCMAS Member

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2015
    Messages:
    1,516
    Likes Received:
    471
    Location:
    Plymouth
    Not sure. All my heaters are in my garage...
     
    • Like Like x 1
  10. Flounder

    Flounder BRS Reef Squad!
    TCMAS Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2007
    Messages:
    4,628
    Likes Received:
    439
    Location:
    Crystal
    3x 500w finnex titanium (straight on/off) controlled by apex.

    1x 78.6
    1x 78.0
    1x 76.0
     
  11. Flounder

    Flounder BRS Reef Squad!
    TCMAS Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2007
    Messages:
    4,628
    Likes Received:
    439
    Location:
    Crystal
    I've had more issues with heaters that have thier own controller overriding the apex controller.
     
  12. Nezw0001

    Nezw0001 I contributed!
    Lifetime Member Event Committee Meeting Host 2019 Meeting Host 2018

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2012
    Messages:
    309
    Likes Received:
    69
    Location:
    west central MN
    I do like flounder does but I made sure all three are on separate breakers
     
  13. Ben Nicholls

    Ben Nicholls TCMAS Old Timer
    Lifetime Member Meeting Host 2018

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2007
    Messages:
    1,341
    Likes Received:
    224
    Location:
    Apple Valley, MN, USA
    I run 3 (only because I already had two 200w ones when I upgraded). All Finex. I run the pair of 200w at night and the 300w during the day. They are Apex controlled and the inactive heater(s) are set to kick in if the primary is not keeping up. I also have an alert set to fire if all 3 run more than 30 minutes straight. That usually indicates a bad heater of some other problem.

    The advantage of switching them off like that is that every heaters get to be primary at least once a day and you can be sure all of them are working. If you have one that is always backup, you run the risk it failed and you don't know it. Here's the Apex code.

    [Heater 1 & 2]

    Fallback OFF
    If Tmp < 79.9 Then ON
    If Tmp > 80.1 Then OFF
    If Time 12:00 to 23:59 Then OFF
    If Tmp < 79.7 Then ON
    If Tmp > 82.0 Then OFF
    If Tmp < 60.0 Then OFF

    [Heater 3]

    Fallback OFF
    If Tmp < 79.9 Then ON
    If Tmp > 80.1 Then OFF
    If Time 00:00 to 11:59 Then OFF
    If Tmp < 79.7 Then ON
    If Tmp > 82.0 Then OFF
    If Tmp < 60.0 Then OFF

    [virtual outlet for alert]

    Set OFF
    If Output Heat1 = ON Then ON
    If Output Heat2 = ON Then ON
    If Output Heat3 = OFF Then OFF
    Defer 030:00 Then ON
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
  14. DarkSky

    DarkSky Administrator
    Site Admin Lifetime Member Event Committee Meeting Host 2019 Meeting Host 2018

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2016
    Messages:
    1,634
    Likes Received:
    576
    Location:
    Eden Prairie
    Two eheim jagers, 200w I think.

    I have them set to 79F. I have my Apex controlling them so they're turned on below 76, off at 78. If my apex fails, the jagers should kick on and stop themselves.

    I've always replaced my heaters at the one year mark, so I'm coming up on that soon.
     
  15. jlanger

    jlanger "The North Remembers"
    Lifetime Member Event Committee

    Joined:
    May 8, 2010
    Messages:
    4,548
    Likes Received:
    1,150
    Location:
    New Richmond, WI
    Is this line of code a failsafe against if the heaters become exposed to air and shutting the heaters down???
    If so, do you have a temperature probe in that chamber of the sump? Or is it placed somewhere else?



    Speaking of temperature probes...
    I have two temperature probes on my system; one in the sump and one in my exterior overflow box. If for some reason my return pump is powered off and stops pushing water through the system, the temperature probe in my overflow box will alert me to the falling water temperature in the display.
     
  16. Ben Nicholls

    Ben Nicholls TCMAS Old Timer
    Lifetime Member Meeting Host 2018

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2007
    Messages:
    1,341
    Likes Received:
    224
    Location:
    Apple Valley, MN, USA
    It is mainly to protect against a faulty temp probe. If it for some reason fails and reads an impossibly low temp I want avoid cooking the tank. I also have a line in the alert programing to throw an error. If I wanted to cover the probe in air I'd have to set that to about what the house temp is.

    I have one probe in the sump with the heaters.
     
  17. Flounder

    Flounder BRS Reef Squad!
    TCMAS Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2007
    Messages:
    4,628
    Likes Received:
    439
    Location:
    Crystal
    Like jason, 2 temp probes is a good idea and an easy way to see if the return pump is running. I have 1 in my overflow and 1 in the sump (before the heaters)
    Many people make the mistake of putting the heaters before the probe.
     
  18. infinityends

    infinityends Senior Member
    TCMAS Supporter

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2014
    Messages:
    687
    Likes Received:
    59
    Location:
    Crystal, MN
    I have 3x 100w Jager heaters. 1x set to average cycle on/off to keep water at 77 +/- 0.3 degrees. The other 2x are on a single outlet and are set to kick in if temp drops to 76.0 or less
     

Share This Page