News from your BOD (1 Viewer)

[General0]

THank you to the BOD's for your work. I would not have the time to devote full time to something like this so I appreciate your time spent. With that said this thread has gone in circles and is absolutely pointless because nothing will be changed unless you go to the next business meeting and vote people! David I will asure you there will be a paid member going to the next business meeting...I think the times of the few making the decisions for the mass of the club have hit a sensitive point with a lot of people including myself. If I'm going to be involved in this club any further I want to be part of things like this. Just a suggestion though, why not make the business meeting a mandatory view like this thread was just as a heads up to everyone? It's my own fault for not reading the notice about the last one. I had no clue there was a business meeting scheduled. Is there an agenda laid out for the meetings or is it something of a free for all for those who attend to voice their concerns/issues?

if it was more publicized maybe the turn out would have been better and we would not have such an out roar about the changes as we do now. I know there are just a few people here posting concerns about the changes but I'm pretty sure there are even more who have issues with them who choose not to voice them. If at all possible make it a mandatory view for important things like this.

I still like the option to pay to be a member. It helps both in funding events we all get to enjoy and access to the full member site options. I'm on the fence about the classifieds changes but would like to see how it goes before I can give an opinion on it. Thank you all for your work but as in everything Change is inevitable. Growth is optional. I hope these changes don't restrict our growth.

 

[SmnParish]

I've kept myself away from this thread recently by telling myself this; if the new rules regarding the classifieds actually are for the better, we will all be happier, and that is a good thing; if the rules turn out to not work so well and it is obviously hurting the club, it will be fixed. In the end, everything will work out.

 

[acharpenter]

I've kept myself away from this thread recently by telling myself this; if the new rules regarding the classifieds actually are for the better, we will all be happier, and that is a good thing; if the rules turn out to not work so well and it is obviously hurting the club, it will be fixed. In the end, everything will work out.

Indeed, I agree - you get rep points for that one dude

 

[SmnParish]

Is it proper etiquete to thank when given rep points? or is it like when a judge lets you win an objection but you don't thank them for it? lol, so much to learn

I think...Thank you very much!

 

[patent]

Because this reduces the amount of education newbies are exposed to, closing the classifieds to "memebers only" violates the two statements I put in bold font

You are quite simply, plainly, and irretrievably wrong about this. If you disagree, feel free to sue us for violating our bylaws. I will defend the suit for free, you will lose, and you will finally learn how far off base you are.

The statements you bolded:

promotes fellowship and support among saltwater aquarists of all experience levels . . . . Through the exchange of knowledge and experiences we help each other become better, more responsible and successful enthusiasts.

There is absolutely no legal principle that requires an organization to undertake each and every method of performing the goals in its bylaws that someone, somewhere, makes some remote argument would help meet that goal. Even if, every now and then, a classifieds sale does help exchange knowledge, it is hardly the only way. If you were correct, that simply because once upon a time, or even several times, knowledge was exchanged, and fellowship promoted, that would not require us to keep classifieds open to everyone. If that argument would be true, we would also be REQUIRED to write a few books, have a radio show, a podcast, meetings at bars to promote fellowship (and of course paid for by the club, as we can clearly see that spending $30 is too much for some), etc., etc., as those are all BETTER means of providing education or fellowship than the one you complain about.

Nor are we required to distribute said knowledge and fellowship to all comers. Were that true, we would not be allowed to limit access to any forums to members only, or even require that you sign up to view the website. We could not ban people, etc.

 

[a1t2o]

That would be completely circumventing the entire "closed classifieds issue" at hand

How so? The problem we have now is that people are coming on just for the classifieds or are abusing them. This would put the control back into the hands of the members that choose to sell to the non-members that are asking for an item. It would prevent a "seller" from using the forum as free advertising. I don't see how there would be much if any abuse with this strategy as the nature of the sale would be turned around so the seller had the power to offer the price. No more low-ballers, or non-serious buyers/posters. If need be, the threads could be set to be viewed only by the ones who start it and the members. I just think it would be a good way to let club members give a good deal to someone that is just getting started.

 

[patent]

Just a suggestion though, why not make the business meeting a mandatory view like this thread was just as a heads up to everyone?

It usually is a mandatory read.

Is there an agenda laid out for the meetings or is it something of a free for all for those who attend to voice their concerns/issues?

There is usually an agenda of sorts, but in the end its up to those present to make motions they wish to make, so there is at least a bit of a free for all at any business meeting.

if it was more publicized maybe the turn out would have been better and we would not have such an out roar about the changes as we do now.

There is always a roar about changes, no matter how publicized the bus. mtg is, nor how many attend. The largest best attended meeting we had generated a huge uproar afterwards. The next largest I know of did as well, but that was many years ago.

 

[acharpenter]

That would be completely circumventing the entire "closed classifieds issue" at hand

How so? The problem we have now is that people are coming on just for the classifieds or are abusing them. This would put the control back into the hands of the members that choose to sell to the non-members that are asking for an item. It would prevent a "seller" from using the forum as free advertising. I don't see how there would be much if any abuse with this strategy as the nature of the sale would be turned around so the seller had the power to offer the price. No more low-ballers, or non-serious buyers/posters. If need be, the threads could be set to be viewed only by the ones who start it and the members. I just think it would be a good way to let club members give a good deal to someone that is just getting started.

Because the classifieds are going to be limited to members and supporters

WTB threads are classifieds - so they will be closed as well

 

[General0]

Thanks Patent, I must have totally blanked it out. My wife just had our new baby this week so I've been cruising on auto pilot. I'm sure it does make an uproar as does anything with politics/decision making involved can.

 

[a1t2o]

Because the classifieds are going to be limited to members and supporters

WTB threads are classifieds - so they will be closed as well

My point is to change it so the WTB is different. I'm looking for a better solution to achieve the intent behind the rule, since the true goal is to prevent people from abusing the classifieds. And before you say it, I know about the voting process. I was just hoping that we could remove the WTB from the classifieds section so that it would not be affected by the rule change.

 

[acharpenter]

My point is to change it so the WTB is different. I'm looking for a better solution to achieve the intent behind the rule, since the true goal is to prevent people from abusing the classifieds. And before you say it, I know about the voting process. I was just hoping that we could remove the WTB from the classifieds section so that it would not be affected by the rule change.

I understood your point- please understand mine

ALL classifieds will be limited to members/sponsors

This change is going into place as it is - exactly how MAXreefer outlined it in the OP

NOTHING will be changed what so ever without a member vote at the next business meeting



So short answer is no

 

[LowersMyBP]

- Increases value of the sponsorship, possibly bringing in more sponsors. Sales by sponsors are more visible to nonmembers.

I do think this is important and not often thought about.

I have never looked at our books in any way, but I am under the assumption that the sponsors have been 'paying the freight' around here in more than one way.

1. Sponsor fees when applicable.
2. Donations at frag swaps for raffles that lead to ticket sales.

Read through this thread, and there is often talk about how this may force people to have to spend money at a sponsor's store (or LFS in general). If I were a sponsor, reading this, I would feel resentment. They are paying fees and donating items in order to support this club and its website and the reward? Fewer people shopping/buying from them? They are getting advertising, yes, but it is somewhat cannibalistic. I won't speculate as to the balance of the two.


My thoughts otherwise:
I support the BOD. I support the club. I support the sponsors. I support the animals that live in tanks everywhere.


I watch build/new to the hobby threads just like the rest of you. I have in the past, while reading through those threads, identified a need and PM'd the person indicating I have something to help them. I have given away return pumps and powerheads. I have given away a refractometer because I noticed the guy was using a hydrometer and I had a spare one at the time. I have met a guy at SWE to help program his RKL when it was on the fritz. All of this, because of a build thread, not WTB or classifieds. I saw a thread on reef central once, it said the guy lived close by, I Pm'd him out of the blue, I now count him as one of my reefing friends. No commerce involved.

This is club behavior, it leads to what you are demanding, just in the reverse order. You are demanding commerce that then leads to interaction. The club has determined that it wants interaction to lead to commerce.

Give it a shot. If you abandon it, then all you really wanted was a new classification on craigslist. Why don't you call him up and demand a marine sub category? Call ebay, demand the same. Amazon? This club is small and local, so you think you can bully it? You can effect change only by becoming involved, and that is all the club is endeavoring to achieve here. Once you become involved, you may or may not press forward. The club is waiting to see what happens.


Interaction will lead to commerce. If you are unable to interact without commerce, then this isn't the place for you at the moment.


I stick with this club because I want to know what will be next. I want to see how Northside Reef's system turns out. I want to see how much success chad has with his breeding. I want to see how Grigor's tank progresses year after year. I long for Energy to set that bugger up as a reef again so I can pester him to come see it. I want Steve77 to become active and host a meeting so I can come see his shark tank. I want to see a full tank shot of 90ct's tank(s). I want to see the massive school of fish that live in Liono's tank. I want to get to Kjdeut's tank again to see how big his clams are now. I go to murrays when I can to see the clownfish swimming in and out of the clam there. I pester Mrbill when I have free time to allow me to come visit him. That is over an hour's drive, just so I can go sit in front of his tank and peek at his basement system. Mike at wetone has one of the nicest tanks I've seen, I plan to pester him again someday, I just don't get to his store often enough to feel like I can. I am constantly surprised, it happens everyday. Like the day a guy set up a tank with a 5 Gallon pail as his sump or when JMJ???? in Cold Spring showed me his sump was made out of food grade storage containers joined together with flexible pvc. The list can go on and on and on.

Interaction and the desire to see and learn has kept me here, not the commerce. That interaction has, on occasion, lead to commerce. It can for everyone.

To steal from Chad's Avatar, "onward, TCMAS, to glory!'

 

[acharpenter]

This club is small and local, so you think you can bully it? You can effect change only by becoming involved, and that is all the club is endeavoring to achieve here.

While I agree with everything you said - just wanted to highlight the above

Thank you

 

[eschulist]

LOTS OF TEXT :laugh:
Interaction will lead to commerce.

This ^

I'm not super active outside of the website as I only have a small tank, but for me the fun is living vicariously through people with large tanks and going to the LFSs to see all the cool fish that I wish I could have. I've ventured into other peoples homes and for me I got way more out of that meeting people than I did from the couple frags that were exchanged. I made friends and hope someday to share my tiny tank with others as well.

So if this gets me more active as well as others. Im all for it.

 

[LowersMyBP]

This ^

I'm not super active outside of the website as I only have a small tank, but for me the fun is living vicariously through people with large tanks and going to the LFSs to see all the cool fish that I wish I could have. I've ventured into other peoples homes and for me I got way more out of that meeting people than I did from the couple frags that were exchanged. I made friends and hope someday to share my tiny tank with others as well.

Hey, your tank is cool. I pestered you too! I thought that tunze skimmer would fit in your sump. Turns out, I was wrong..but I got to see your tank...and that was my true motivation!

 

[eschulist]

Hey, your tank is cool. I pestered you too! I thought that tunze skimmer would fit in your sump. Turns out, I was wrong..but I got to see your tank...and that was my true motivation!

Yep I definitely remembered you stopping over in the middle of your work day to try it out. I was impressed!! I wish it would have worked too but I've gotten the system working fairly well without one so I just keep on going. Thanks again though for always trying to help out.

 

[BashfulBacterium]

My point is to change it so the WTB is different. I'm looking for a better solution to achieve the intent behind the rule, since the true goal is to prevent people from abusing the classifieds. And before you say it, I know about the voting process. I was just hoping that we could remove the WTB from the classifieds section so that it would not be affected by the rule change.

Which would require a vote to change. . . they make changes based off what club members want, not off their own will.

 

[Matt D.]

I do think this is important and not often thought about.

I have never looked at our books in any way, but I am under the assumption that the sponsors have been 'paying the freight' around here in more than one way.

1. Sponsor fees when applicable.
2. Donations at frag swaps for raffles that lead to ticket sales.

Read through this thread, and there is often talk about how this may force people to have to spend money at a sponsor's store (or LFS in general). If I were a sponsor, reading this, I would feel resentment. They are paying fees and donating items in order to support this club and its website and the reward? Fewer people shopping/buying from them? They are getting advertising, yes, but it is somewhat cannibalistic. I won't speculate as to the balance of the two.


My thoughts otherwise:
I support the BOD. I support the club. I support the sponsors. I support the animals that live in tanks everywhere.


I watch build/new to the hobby threads just like the rest of you. I have in the past, while reading through those threads, identified a need and PM'd the person indicating I have something to help them. I have given away return pumps and powerheads. I have given away a refractometer because I noticed the guy was using a hydrometer and I had a spare one at the time. I have met a guy at SWE to help program his RKL when it was on the fritz. All of this, because of a build thread, not WTB or classifieds. I saw a thread on reef central once, it said the guy lived close by, I Pm'd him out of the blue, I now count him as one of my reefing friends. No commerce involved.

This is club behavior, it leads to what you are demanding, just in the reverse order. You are demanding commerce that then leads to interaction. The club has determined that it wants interaction to lead to commerce.

Give it a shot. If you abandon it, then all you really wanted was a new classification on craigslist. Why don't you call him up and demand a marine sub category? Call ebay, demand the same. Amazon? This club is small and local, so you think you can bully it? You can effect change only by becoming involved, and that is all the club is endeavoring to achieve here. Once you become involved, you may or may not press forward. The club is waiting to see what happens.


Interaction will lead to commerce. If you are unable to interact without commerce, then this isn't the place for you at the moment.


I stick with this club because I want to know what will be next. I want to see how Northside Reef's system turns out. I want to see how much success chad has with his breeding. I want to see how Grigor's tank progresses year after year. I long for Energy to set that bugger up as a reef again so I can pester him to come see it. I want Steve77 to become active and host a meeting so I can come see his shark tank. I want to see a full tank shot of 90ct's tank(s). I want to see the massive school of fish that live in Liono's tank. I want to get to Kjdeut's tank again to see how big his clams are now. I go to murrays when I can to see the clownfish swimming in and out of the clam there. I pester Mrbill when I have free time to allow me to come visit him. That is over an hour's drive, just so I can go sit in front of his tank and peek at his basement system. Mike at wetone has one of the nicest tanks I've seen, I plan to pester him again someday, I just don't get to his store often enough to feel like I can. I am constantly surprised, it happens everyday. Like the day a guy set up a tank with a 5 Gallon pail as his sump or when JMJ???? in Cold Spring showed me his sump was made out of food grade storage containers joined together with flexible pvc. The list can go on and on and on.

Interaction and the desire to see and learn has kept me here, not the commerce. That interaction has, on occasion, lead to commerce. It can for everyone.

To steal from Chad's Avatar, "onward, TCMAS, to glory!'

 

[NorthSide Reef]

I do think this is important and not often thought about.

I have never looked at our books in any way, but I am under the assumption that the sponsors have been 'paying the freight' around here in more than one way.

1. Sponsor fees when applicable.
2. Donations at frag swaps for raffles that lead to ticket sales.

Read through this thread, and there is often talk about how this may force people to have to spend money at a sponsor's store (or LFS in general). If I were a sponsor, reading this, I would feel resentment. They are paying fees and donating items in order to support this club and its website and the reward? Fewer people shopping/buying from them? They are getting advertising, yes, but it is somewhat cannibalistic. I won't speculate as to the balance of the two.


My thoughts otherwise:
I support the BOD. I support the club. I support the sponsors. I support the animals that live in tanks everywhere.


I watch build/new to the hobby threads just like the rest of you. I have in the past, while reading through those threads, identified a need and PM'd the person indicating I have something to help them. I have given away return pumps and powerheads. I have given away a refractometer because I noticed the guy was using a hydrometer and I had a spare one at the time. I have met a guy at SWE to help program his RKL when it was on the fritz. All of this, because of a build thread, not WTB or classifieds. I saw a thread on reef central once, it said the guy lived close by, I Pm'd him out of the blue, I now count him as one of my reefing friends. No commerce involved.

This is club behavior, it leads to what you are demanding, just in the reverse order. You are demanding commerce that then leads to interaction. The club has determined that it wants interaction to lead to commerce.

Give it a shot. If you abandon it, then all you really wanted was a new classification on craigslist. Why don't you call him up and demand a marine sub category? Call ebay, demand the same. Amazon? This club is small and local, so you think you can bully it? You can effect change only by becoming involved, and that is all the club is endeavoring to achieve here. Once you become involved, you may or may not press forward. The club is waiting to see what happens.


Interaction will lead to commerce. If you are unable to interact without commerce, then this isn't the place for you at the moment.


I stick with this club because I want to know what will be next. I want to see how Northside Reef's system turns out. I want to see how much success chad has with his breeding. I want to see how Grigor's tank progresses year after year. I long for Energy to set that bugger up as a reef again so I can pester him to come see it. I want Steve77 to become active and host a meeting so I can come see his shark tank. I want to see a full tank shot of 90ct's tank(s). I want to see the massive school of fish that live in Liono's tank. I want to get to Kjdeut's tank again to see how big his clams are now. I go to murrays when I can to see the clownfish swimming in and out of the clam there. I pester Mrbill when I have free time to allow me to come visit him. That is over an hour's drive, just so I can go sit in front of his tank and peek at his basement system. Mike at wetone has one of the nicest tanks I've seen, I plan to pester him again someday, I just don't get to his store often enough to feel like I can. I am constantly surprised, it happens everyday. Like the day a guy set up a tank with a 5 Gallon pail as his sump or when JMJ???? in Cold Spring showed me his sump was made out of food grade storage containers joined together with flexible pvc. The list can go on and on and on.

Interaction and the desire to see and learn has kept me here, not the commerce. That interaction has, on occasion, lead to commerce. It can for everyone.

To steal from Chad's Avatar, "onward, TCMAS, to glory!'

+100,000,000

This post should just end this thread, I think it states it all.

 

[REEFSTOCK]

I have not read this thread. Got some work to do. I have a few comments to repeat, from the years past.

1) if you cant make it to a buisness meeting to put your input, don't post on something already decided. Send an Email to the BOD if you really need to say something.
2) $30 is nothing for all the community service provided.

I don't have an oppinion on these decisions, but I am sure happy to see a bunch of folks doing their best for the reefing community!
Thanks for your time, effort and lovin'!